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Old 07-25-2007, 09:44 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by AnimeSpirit
I agree with Pie. The minimum wage increase will only effect people who are working minimum wage jobs.

Also, we need to be clear about one thing. Productivity has nothing to do with how much a particular field of employment pays. What makes one field of employment pay more than another? Is the productivity? NO! It's the rarity of the skills needed to fill that position. I've worked in McDonald's before, flipping hamburgers, and I will admit that I worked longer and harder hours doing that then the standard 9 to 5 job I work now. Yet, my current job pays more.

Personally, I think if far fewer people flocked to these minimum wage jobs, the demand for these jobs would increase, causing an increase in pay for that field. That's supply and demand for you. Maybe employment just isn't dispersed enough, but what can you do short of supporting communism?
Supply and demand.
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Old 07-25-2007, 09:48 AM   #47
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I can agree that if a company can't afford to pay the higher wage, than they will likely increase the cost of their goods. However, if the company pays higher than minimum wage to begin with, they could expect a more generous productivity from their employees, thus higher income for the overall company. When such minimum wage raises like this come along, the company would not be effected in the least.

It's really a competition between worker and boss. Both are trying to make more money from the other. If the boss demonstrates that he is willing to toss a bone once in a while, than the worker will likely work harder. After that, it is up to the boss to decide if the worker's performance meets the reward.
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Old 07-25-2007, 09:51 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by Isabella
Piemaker, you are missing the point everyone is trying to make to you. Many businesses cannot afford the increase in minimum wage to over $7 per hour. They will eliminate jobs then the people you are referring to will not have a job. Another point, they will have to increase the price for services/goods. Cost of living will increase. They will not be better off. If an employer is making enough profit they will increase their rate of pay to employees who deserve it. Employers should have the freedom to make this decision themselves, not the federal governmemt. I have tried to explain it as simple as I can for you.
I do understand what you are saying but do you understand that some employers even if they can afford to raise their employees pay won't. They are tight, they do not want to get off of it, they are satified to pay the least amount they can because it leaves more for them. you get talking about cost of living increases but the cost of living has been going up these last few years without a wage increase. Look at the price of gas the last 2 years that is not because of the wage increase.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:05 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by Isabella
Piemaker, please don't take offense. I don't mean to be picking on you. You are not looking at the whole picture, though. It would be wonderful if everyone could make higher wages.
Don't worry I'm not taking offense and I don't think you are picking on me. But I also think you are not seeing the whole picture. I agree the government should not tell employers what to pay, I also agree it should be up to the employer to run his business. I understand all of that. I understand that business cost could go up but if a employer was already paying above minimum then he should not have to go up on his goods.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:20 AM   #50
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You can not blame the wage increase for the cost of living increase. The cost of living increase is because of the government and your big oil companies and companies like sweepco that has no competition for their product. Do you think sweepco would have as many customers for power if there was another company with cheaper rates. That is another case of your supply and demand. They supply power, there is a demand for it but there is no competition so they charge whatever they want to a certain point. It's pay what we charge or we'll cut you off. Great for supply and demand. Another thing that affects the cost of living, people like that CEO of Enron, how many people did he put the shaft too? No the wage increase was not responsible for that.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:24 AM   #51
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I will have to weigh in on this one. What it comes down to is we will have to do more with less. In the end the people living on the bottom level of income will find themselves with out a job. The sad part is the people with out money will vote for the people that are doing this to them.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:29 AM   #52
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I will have to weigh in on this one. What it comes down to is we will have to do more with less. In the end the people living on the bottom level of income will find themselves with out a job. The sad part is the people with out money will vote for the people that are doing this to them.
So the answer is to keep the little guy down no matter what.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:33 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by piemaker720
So the answer is to keep the little guy down no matter what.
the answer is government does not have the right to dictate to a business owner how much he or she has to pay some one for services rendered !! This attitude is why we have so many Mexicans coming over the border to do work that Americans are to good to do. There is no excuse for being lazy.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:42 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by guitarman
the answer is government does not have the right to dictate to a business owner how much he or she has to pay some one for services rendered !! This attitude is why we have so many Mexicans coming over the border to do work that Americans are to good to do. There is no excuse for being lazy.
That is true, but what about the companies that move to another country for the cheap labor. Companies that have fired workers to move. I agree the government does not have the right but if you don't want the raise then copanies should lower their prices so people can afford them. I'm talking oil companies , light companies , gas companies and so fourth.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:47 AM   #55
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Also do you think our elected people deserve the big bucks they make. A lot of our polticians own business that they make money at but they still draw enormous paychecks from us. And we give them the power to vote theirself a raise when they want.
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Old 07-25-2007, 11:19 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by guitarman
I will have to weigh in on this one. What it comes down to is we will have to do more with less. In the end the people living on the bottom level of income will find themselves with out a job. The sad part is the people with out money will vote for the people that are doing this to them.
TRUE!
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Old 07-25-2007, 11:23 AM   #57
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Originally Posted by piemaker720
Also do you think our elected people deserve the big bucks they make. A lot of our politicians own business that they make money at but they still draw enormous paychecks from us. And we give them the power to vote their self a raise when they want.
No I do not give it to them. I NEVER vote for a democRAT that is like a vote for the ACLU and trial lawyers
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Old 07-25-2007, 11:23 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by piemaker720
You know I don't understand why all of you are griping and so against the minimum wage increase. This raise only affects a small portion of workers. If you already make above minimum wage then you will not be getting a raise. It is to help the little people catch up with the economy. You can talk how the people needs to go to school to improve themselves but someone still has to do these jobs. It is also fine and good when you can sit in judgement of these people in your life, with your family and home and you have alot of single parents with children trying to do the best they can with what they can get. If you really understood you know life throws things at people out of the blue. A man dies and the wife has never worked, she has kids she has to take care of. It happens. Sure there are some people in these low paying jobs that are worthless and sorry but those same type of people run your big corperations too. Do you think a CEO of a corperation should deserve to make 6 figure paychecks? I have been where the little people are and unless you have you will never know how they feel. You can also say if a person doesn't like what they are being paid, quit and go somewhere else, but then the boss that pays low will not keep workers. Big amounts of turn overs cost more than a faithful employee that stays put. Have you ever been in a business when everytime you go there someone knew is working and you wonder what is going on.
Let me get this straight. If an employee is a successful CEO and makes 6 figures, that is bad because it is too much? And if an employee is at the bottom rung and makes minimum wage, that is bad too because it is too little? So we need the government to mandate that everyone makes more than the old minimum wage but less than 6 figures? To be fair? To be moral?

I grew up during the cold war with the Soviet Union. As a child we had an former Soviet citizen who excaped that country come and speak to our class and explain how in the USSR, garbage men and doctors all made the same salary, and the government told you what your job is going to be. Government intervention such as minimum wage laws bring our country one step closer to that goal of "fairness for all" (socialism).

If you are counting on government laws to provide fairness, and not the natural laws of supply and demand, then you will be disappointed time and time again and will never earn a chance to become truely independent. I think that government is like crack, every addictive. Once you are high on government, it is hard to get off it.
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Old 07-25-2007, 11:26 AM   #59
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Piemaker, if an employer refuses to give raises then don't work for this company. Truth of the matter there will always be those at the bottom of the totem pole who will never be able to better themselves. Some causes are lack of education, lack of experience, lack of intelligence, and laziness.
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Old 07-25-2007, 11:28 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by rhertz
Let me get this straight. If an employee is a successful CEO and makes 6 figures, that is bad because it is too much? And if an employee is at the bottom rung and makes minimum wage, that is bad too because it is too little? So we need the government to mandate that everyone makes more than the old minimum wage but less than 6 figures? To be fair? To be moral?

I grew up during the cold war with the Soviet Union. As a child we had an former Soviet citizen who excaped that country come and speak to our class and explain how in the USSR, garbage men and doctors all made the same salary, and the government told you what your job is going to be. Government intervention such as minimum wage laws bring our country one step closer to that goal of "fairness for all" (socialism).

If you are counting on government laws to provide fairness, and not the natural laws of supply and demand, then you will be disappointed time and time again and will never earn a chance to become truely independent. I think that government is like crack, every addictive. Once you are high on government, it is hard to get off it.
Great Point!
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