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Old 10-09-2006, 08:50 AM   #1
Isaac-Saxxon
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Foundation of the earth

I know the planet is older than 6000 years. I am a Christian and I love to
dig into history of man and the history of our planet. The dinosaur bones and artifacts
along with the oil we use had to come from a age a lot older than 6000 years
old. This does not discount the Bible but will make it a lot clearer. I found out
the hard way that carbon dating has its problems but so does the idea that
eveything that has happened has happened in 6000 years.

Quote:
To arrive at the true meaning of this expression, we must note that there are two words translated "foundation" in the New Testament : (1) themelios, and (2) katobole.
The noun, themelios, occurs in Luke 6:48, 49; 14:29; Acts 16:26 Rom. 15:20
1 Cor. 3:10 , 11, 12. Eph. 2:20; 1Tim. 6:19 Heb. 6:1; 11:10 . Rev. 21:14, 19.
It is nver used of the world (kosmos) or the earth (ge). Heb. 1:10.
A comparison of all these passages will show that these are proper and regular terms for the English words " to found ", and "foundation".
The noun katabole, occurs in Matt. 13:35; 25:34. Luke 11:50 John 17:24 Eph. 1:4 Heb 4:3;
9:26; 11:11. 1 Peter 1:20 Rev. 13:8; 17:8; and the corresponding Verb (kataballo and katabole are not the proper terms for founding and foundation, but the correct meaning is casting down, or overthrow.
Consistency, therefore, calls for the same translation in Heb. 6:1, where, instead of
"not laying again", the rendering should be "not casting down". That is to say, the foundation
already laid, of repentance, & e., was not to be cast down or overthrown, but was to be left
and progress made unto the perfection.
Accordingly, the Noun katabole, derived from and cognate with the Verb, ought to be translated
"disruption", or "ruin".
The remarkable thing that in all occurrences (except Heb. 11:11) the word is connected with "the world" (Gr. kosmos. Ap. 129.1), and therefore the expression should be rendered
"the disruption (or ruin) of the world". clearly referring to the condition indicated in Gen 1:2,
and described in 2 Peter3:5, 6. For the earth was not created tohu (Isa. 45:18), but became so,
as stated the Hebrew of Gen. 1:2 and confirmed by 2 Peter 3:6, where "the world that then was by the word of God" (Gen 1:1), perished, and "the heavens and the earth which are now, by the same word" were created (Gen. 2:4), and are "kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment" (2 Peter 3:7) which shall usher in the "new heavens and the new earth"
of 2 Peter 3:13.
"The disruption of the world" is an event forming a great dividing line in the dispensation
of the ages. In Gen. 1:1 we have the founding of the world (Heb 1:10 = themelioo), but in Gen 1:2 we have its overthrow.
This is confirmed by a further remarkable fact, that the phrase, which occurs ten times,
is associated with the Preposition apo = from (Ap. 104. iv) seven times, and with pro = before
(Ap. 104 xiv) three times. The former refers to the kingdom, and is connected with the
"counsels" of God; the latter refers to the Mystery (of secret. See Ap 192 ) and is connected with the "purpose" of God (see John 17:24. Eph 1:4. 1 Peter 1:20).
Ample New Testament testimony is thus given to the profoundly significant fact recorded
in Gen. 1:2, that "the earth became tohu and bohu (i.e. waste and desolate); and darkness was on the face of the deep", before the creation of "the heavens and earth which are now"
(2 Peter 3:7).

(Appendix 146 The Companion Bible, Kregel )

My hope is to get people to read for themselves and know that Christianity
is a reality not a religion !
God Bless
Isaac-Saxxon
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Old 10-09-2006, 04:15 PM   #2
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How old do you think the universe is?

I read your comments and am curious. Using Earths measure of time, how old do you think the universe is? A simple answer, please, in round numbers.
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Old 10-09-2006, 06:06 PM   #3
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How old ?

In short from what I have studied in the history books for the last 22 years
I think flesh man has been here 10-14000 years and as far as the universe
goes I dont know ? I was mistaken about how far carbon dating goes back
and there is a geoloical boundry its called uridium boundry. Spelling ? but thats
close, there is a line where nothing was living then the spawn of man.
That still does not tell me how old the planet and or universe is. Any ideas
I would love to hear ! I still dont think 6000 years for the whole universe is
in order at all. Thanks. Isaac-Saxxon
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Old 10-09-2006, 09:08 PM   #4
geodood
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From NASA's website

"Until recently, astronomers estimated that the Big Bang occurred between 12 and 14 billion years ago. To put this in perspective, the Solar System is thought to be 4.5 billion years old and humans have existed as a species for a few million years. Astronomers estimate the age of the universe in two ways: 1) by looking for the oldest stars; and 2) by measuring the rate of expansion of the universe and extrapolating back to the Big Bang; just as crime detectives can trace the origin of a bullet from the holes in a wall."

http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov/m_uni/uni_101age.html

I understand their Big Bang statements, however I wonder what they base their statement "humans have existed as a species for a few million years". I guess that they are including "Lucy" type beings. (all hominids that is)

http://www.asu.edu/clas/iho/lucy.html#age

So when did Homo Sapien enter the picture? (from both a fossile and historic record?) Not our "ancestors" but "us"?
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Old 10-09-2006, 11:50 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geodood
I understand their Big Bang statements, however I wonder what they base their statement "humans have existed as a species for a few million years". I guess that they are including "Lucy" type beings. (all hominids that is)

http://www.asu.edu/clas/iho/lucy.html#age

So when did Homo Sapien enter the picture? (from both a fossile and historic record?) Not our "ancestors" but "us"?
Homo Erectus some 1.5 - 1 million years ago, Homo Sapiens some 1/2 a million years ago.

"Lucy" is an Australopithecus Ramidus .. some 3.2 million years ago. they found something that dates back a bit farther than lucy. and judging by the bone structure was a bi-ped. which dates back to almost 4 million years ago.
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Old 10-10-2006, 12:45 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rough Rider
Homo Erectus some 1.5 - 1 million years ago, Homo Sapiens some 1/2 a million years ago.

"Lucy" is an Australopithecus Ramidus .. some 3.2 million years ago. they found something that dates back a bit farther than lucy. and judging by the bone structure was a bi-ped. which dates back to almost 4 million years ago.
I wonder how the 500,000 year mark for Homo Spiens is arrived at? Documented history goes back, what about 3000 years? Even if the figure is 5000 years, that leaves 495,000 years of undocumented (pre-historic) history? Wow, so much that we don't know.
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Old 10-10-2006, 08:13 AM   #7
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The silver thread of truth

I would say that truth exist. Now that does not mean I know or you what
IT is. It would seem we spend a good part of our life trying to find that
truth. There are buildings we can not explain how they where built and
other things that would point to a high level of civilization such as Easter Island or the Great Pyramid of Giza. We still can not match the work that
the masons did on the Pyramid. I have an idea how this "might" have happened and will do a bit of home work before I post again.
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Old 10-10-2006, 09:39 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geodood
I wonder how the 500,000 year mark for Homo Spiens is arrived at? Documented history goes back, what about 3000 years? Even if the figure is 5000 years, that leaves 495,000 years of undocumented (pre-historic) history? Wow, so much that we don't know.
Did you see "Mission to Mars" ? that EXPLAINS EVERYTHING
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Old 10-11-2006, 08:32 AM   #9
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Lot of rocks there but no sign of life

Maybe you saw something I did not on your mission to Mars ? That 90% of
our brain that science says we dont use may have good info in it ? Man in
the spiritual body for millions of years and man in the clay shell for 10-14000
years and back to the spiritual body to be judged. The fall of man (Adam)
redeemed by one man (Christ). A day with the Lord is a thousand years.
It took six days for the creation of clay man. One day of rest. Four thousand
years untill Shiloh (Christ) come and two thousand years until present day.
There is still one day left after the return of Christ. That would make up
two weeks with the Lord. "I" believe spiritual man was here with clay dinosaurs until Satans pride brought down a world that was in order now
it grieved God to make man in the flesh. God said replenish the earth
not "plenish" . My thoughts are that the planet used to be on its true
axis and now is not mabe a comet hit the Gulf of Mexico and the planet
used to be 90 miles closer to the sun and the firmamnet was in place
and all was in harmony. All souls where created at one time. Each man
comes thru the water but once. That is to say be borned of woman.
God knew Jeremiah in the womb and John the Baptist and Christ and
Esau and Jacob too. God knew all of us before we where born. My hope is
that people will study there Bible for themselves and seek God.
God Bless,
Isaac-Saxxon
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Old 10-11-2006, 09:56 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isaac-Saxxon
Maybe you saw something I did not on your mission to Mars ?
Well.. I was referring to the movie "Mission to Mars" their premise was that there was life on Mars a 'really long' time ago, and before their planet went up in 'smoke' from a massive meteor strike, they "sprinkled" the earth with just the right "mix" of their DNA or whatever. To be clear.. I was partially joking... but I also find it fascinating.

I've wondered, who's to say that in several million years from now.. or longer, who's to say this planet doesn't turn into a dust bowl and look just like Mars does now. And all that would be left is some funny lookin' mounds in Egypt, when some other race of beings stumble on to our planet and wonder if there was EVER any life here.
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Old 10-11-2006, 11:01 AM   #11
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Did not see the movie

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rough Rider
Well.. I was referring to the movie "Mission to Mars" their premise was that there was life on Mars a 'really long' time ago, and before their planet went up in 'smoke' from a massive meteor strike, they "sprinkled" the earth with just the right "mix" of their DNA or whatever. To be clear.. I was partially joking... but I also find it fascinating.

I've wondered, who's to say that in several million years from now.. or longer, who's to say this planet doesn't turn into a dust bowl and look just like Mars does now. And all that would be left is some funny lookin' mounds in Egypt, when some other race of beings stumble on to our planet and wonder if there was EVER any life here.
I do agree that this planet has the markings of a time before this time (age)
and to find palm wood 800 feet deep in Alaska and so many other things
like buildings that where way ahead of there time. Where they ? or are
we just late in the game. How many Matrixes have there been ?
Good chat !
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Old 10-12-2006, 12:37 AM   #12
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Roughrider,

I got it! The movie was so-so.... It is a fascinating subject.


Sir Isaac,

You have watched the movie Matrix one too many times! LOL.. I do like the flick and all the "biblical" references such as the "Nebuchadnezzar"
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Old 10-12-2006, 08:25 AM   #13
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Still unplugged !

Hey Geo !
Maybe I have seen it a few times but the questions that we all wonder
about and never ask get brought up and thrown in your face :-) My how
deep is the rabbit hole ? Maybe it depends on the rabbit !
I-S
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Old 02-06-2007, 09:09 AM   #14
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judging by the bone structure was a bi-ped. which dates back to almost 4 million year

I am sure there where bi-peds in the long history of this planet but just because they have a jaw bone of a ape like creature does not make it a man.
The Bible thumping preachers would have you think 6000 years and that is all the time this planet has been here ?? I do not agree it that was the case then oil would be a renewable resource. The Bible states in the first verses of
Gen that the planet became void and with out form and was not made that way so ask your preacher and he might say we do not study that "Old Book" just the New or just do not ask that question.
Isaac
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