Texas governor stirs controversy

Isaac-Saxxon · 05-03-2007, 10:39 AM

Texas Gov. Rick Perry says licensed Texans should be able to carry a concealed handgun almost anywhere.

http://www.ktbs.com/viewnews.cfm?new...weapons%20idea

purpahurl · 05-03-2007, 12:47 PM

Why not. These aren't going to be the people causing trouble anyway, but they can sure stop it! "Those who are willing to give up their guns to make plows will soon be plowing for those who did not"

Isaac-Saxxon · 05-03-2007, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by purpahurl

Why not. These aren't going to be the people causing trouble anyway, but they can sure stop it! "Those who are willing to give up their guns to make plows will soon be plowing for those who did not"

I know I would think twice about pulling my gun out if I thought everyone else around me had one too

LateNight · 05-03-2007, 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isaac-Saxxon

I know I would think twice about pulling my gun out if I thought everyone else around me had one too

that's an interesting point.. I saw an editorial cartoon on that the other day. basically it was like, someone yelled "Gun!" and then EVERYONE pulled out their guns and started shooting.. but didn't know who it was they were supposed to be shooting at....

now maybe that's not realistic ? or maybe it is.. in a perfect world, everyone could just open up on the idiot who started shooting in the first place

BrainSmashR · 05-03-2007, 03:49 PM

Well you guys are basically ignoring history when you make these suggestions.

If you recall, once upon a time it was fairly common for men to openly carry firearms.....why do you think every civilized nation in the world now has laws against this type of behavior?

Here's a hint, it's not because the crime rate went down.....

LateNight · 05-03-2007, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrainSmashR

Well you guys are basically ignoring history when you make these suggestions.

If you recall, once upon a time it was fairly common for men to openly carry firearms.....why do you think every civilized nation in the world now has laws against this type of behavior?

Here's a hint, it's not because the crime rate went down.....

Don't take my comment the wrong way.. it's not that I'm against the idea at all.. If there had been some other folks carrying legal firearms around at Virginia Tech, fewer lives could have been lost. If that idiot could have been gunned down... I just thought it was an interesting point.

BrainSmashR · 05-03-2007, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LateNight

Don't take my comment the wrong way.. it's not that I'm against the idea at all.. If there had been some other folks carrying legal firearms around at Virginia Tech, fewer lives could have been lost. If that idiot could have been gunned down... I just thought it was an interesting point.

Yeah, the problem is that when everyone carried a gun, lot's of people got shot for stupid **** like snoring to loud, not just mass murder.

How can you say fewer lives would have been lost when only 1 man had a gun as opposed to 100 people having a gun, when our own nations history tells the exact opposite story?

joepole · 05-03-2007, 04:52 PM

>why do you think every civilized nation in the world now has laws against this type of behavior

Correct or not, that's not a legit line of reasoning, "Everybody else is doing it" means nothing. Almost every civilized nation in the world has socialized medicine, as well.

joepole · 05-03-2007, 04:56 PM

>How can you say fewer lives would have been lost when only 1 man had a gun as opposed to 100 people having a gun, when our own nations history tells the exact opposite story?

Because it's a reasonable assumption that none of the other likely-to-be-armed students wanted to go on a murderous rampage and it's a logical conclusion that if any other student had killed Cho before he could finish fewer lives would have been lost.

BrainSmashR · 05-03-2007, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joepole

>why do you think every civilized nation in the world now has laws against this type of behavior

Correct or not, that's not a legit line of reasoning, "Everybody else is doing it" means nothing. Almost every civilized nation in the world has socialized medicine, as well.

If it's not a legit line of reasoning, why do you think I'm trying to say that?

More people with guns always equals more murders, not less. That's why most nations have some type of gun laws, not because they want to be like their neighbor!?!?!?!?!?

BrainSmashR · 05-03-2007, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joepole

>How can you say fewer lives would have been lost when only 1 man had a gun as opposed to 100 people having a gun, when our own nations history tells the exact opposite story?

Because it's a reasonable assumption that none of the other likely-to-be-armed students wanted to go on a murderous rampage and it's a logical conclusion that if any other student had killed Cho before he could finish fewer lives would have been lost.

Homicide is the 14th leading cause of death in America today.
Accident is the 3rd leading cause of death, of the accident category, firearm accidents are the 8th leading cause of death.

....and your contention is because there are NOT enough guns on the street.

I'm glad you admitted this was total assumption....I can't find death stats for the 1800's when most men carried a firearm, but I'll be sure to let you knwo when I do

Al Swearengen · 05-03-2007, 06:10 PM

WRONG WRONG WRONG
In March 2000, WorldNetDaily reported that since Australia's widespread gunban, violent crime has INCREASED in the country. WND reported that, although lawmakers responsible for passing the ban promised a safer country, the nation's crime statistics tell a different story:
.Countrywide, homicides are up 3.2 percent
.Assaults are up 8.6 percent
.Amazingly, armed robberies have climbed nearly 45 percent
.In the Australian state of Victoria, gun homicides have climbed 300 percent
.In the 25 years BEFORE the gun bans, crime in Australia had been dropping steadily
.There has been a dramatic increase in home burglaries and assaults on the elderly

The violent crime stats are EVEN WORSE in Great Britain!
__________________

The above is an excerpt from an earlier post of mine where I was replyin to someone else's opinion that "fewer guns equals fewer deaths". It just doesnt work that way...period...end of story! Theres a school in Utah I think where the students with concealed carry permits are encouraged to wear their guns on campus, so lets just have a little hypothetical scenario here. Ok, lets say a "Cho" type murderous a$$hole shows up one at school one mornin and starts shootin people...with me so far? Ya followin me so far? Ok, "Cho" pulls his gun and gets off a few shots and kills a few of his poor, hapless classmates and instructors...but other students and instructors draw their own weapons and tuck "Cho" in for a dirtnap! Total body count? Four dead, includin the aforementioned murderous a$$hole...as opposed to, say, 30 or 50 dead...maybe even more.

The sad truth is that when one of these nuts snaps and decides to go on a shootin spree, be it on a school campus, the post office, your local Luby's cafeteria, or where ever, everyone who is NOT armed is basically just the proverbial "fish in the barrel", whose options amount to hidin under a table, playin dead, beggin the crazy bastard not to shoot em, or runnin and gettin shot in the back! These nutcases KNOW that their victims cant fight back, which is why they can kill so many of them. Different ballgame altogether when there are citizens carryin lawfully concealed guns. Nice try Brain, but you're full of schit! Ya might try doin some research first next time.

BrainSmashR · 05-03-2007, 06:59 PM

Hey that's great....how about stats for this country?

BTW, I did NOT say fewer guns equals fewer deaths, I said MORE guns DOES NOT equal fewer deaths.

Now check out this "hypothetical" scenario. Everytime someone gets pissed off they reach for their guns....you know, like every western story you've ever heard.

Al Swearengen · 05-03-2007, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrainSmashR

Hey that's great....how about stats for this country?

BTW, I did NOT say fewer guns equals fewer deaths, I said MORE guns DOES NOT equal fewer deaths.

Now check out this "hypothetical" scenario. Everytime someone gets pissed off they reach for their guns....you know, like every western story you've ever heard.

On the contrary, more guns do indeed equal fewer deaths. And America's crime rates, violent or otherwise, have been steadily dropping since concealed weapons carry by licensed citizens, along with adoption of the "Castle Doctrine" by the states have become more prevalent. People who are licensed to carry concealed weapons must meet the criteria. Those citizens understand that carrying a concealed weapon means they have a much greater responsibility to conduct themselves with restraint, and draw and use their guns ONLY when they or someone else is threatened with death or grave bodily harm, NOT because they get "pissed off". Those who do NOT understand this likely dont meet the licensing criteria anyway.

LateNight · 05-03-2007, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrainSmashR

Now check out this "hypothetical" scenario. Everytime someone gets pissed off they reach for their guns....you know, like every western story you've ever heard.

more or less guns does not change this scenario.. this happens now as it is.. idiot gets pissed, idiot goes home gets his gun and shoots someone.
If idiot doesn't have a gun, he'll find another way.

05-03-2007, 10:39 AM	#1
Isaac-Saxxon SBLive! Veteran Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 4,421 Rep Power: 331	Texas governor stirs controversy Texas Gov. Rick Perry says licensed Texans should be able to carry a concealed handgun almost anywhere. http://www.ktbs.com/viewnews.cfm?new...weapons%20idea

05-03-2007, 12:47 PM	#2
purpahurl Advanced Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: shreveport Posts: 377 Rep Power: 236	Guns Why not. These aren't going to be the people causing trouble anyway, but they can sure stop it! "Those who are willing to give up their guns to make plows will soon be plowing for those who did not"

05-03-2007, 06:10 PM	#12
Al Swearengen Advanced Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 849 Rep Power: 260	WRONG WRONG WRONG In March 2000, WorldNetDaily reported that since Australia's widespread gunban, violent crime has INCREASED in the country. WND reported that, although lawmakers responsible for passing the ban promised a safer country, the nation's crime statistics tell a different story: .Countrywide, homicides are up 3.2 percent .Assaults are up 8.6 percent .Amazingly, armed robberies have climbed nearly 45 percent .In the Australian state of Victoria, gun homicides have climbed 300 percent .In the 25 years BEFORE the gun bans, crime in Australia had been dropping steadily .There has been a dramatic increase in home burglaries and assaults on the elderly The violent crime stats are EVEN WORSE in Great Britain! __________________ The above is an excerpt from an earlier post of mine where I was replyin to someone else's opinion that "fewer guns equals fewer deaths". It just doesnt work that way...period...end of story! Theres a school in Utah I think where the students with concealed carry permits are encouraged to wear their guns on campus, so lets just have a little hypothetical scenario here. Ok, lets say a "Cho" type murderous a$$hole shows up one at school one mornin and starts shootin people...with me so far? Ya followin me so far? Ok, "Cho" pulls his gun and gets off a few shots and kills a few of his poor, hapless classmates and instructors...but other students and instructors draw their own weapons and tuck "Cho" in for a dirtnap! Total body count? Four dead, includin the aforementioned murderous a$$hole...as opposed to, say, 30 or 50 dead...maybe even more. The sad truth is that when one of these nuts snaps and decides to go on a shootin spree, be it on a school campus, the post office, your local Luby's cafeteria, or where ever, everyone who is NOT armed is basically just the proverbial "fish in the barrel", whose options amount to hidin under a table, playin dead, beggin the crazy bastard not to shoot em, or runnin and gettin shot in the back! These nutcases KNOW that their victims cant fight back, which is why they can kill so many of them. Different ballgame altogether when there are citizens carryin lawfully concealed guns. Nice try Brain, but you're full of schit! Ya might try doin some research first next time. __________________ Molon Labe! Last edited by Al Swearengen; 05-03-2007 at 06:54 PM.

05-03-2007, 03:49 PM	#5
BrainSmashR Banned Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Natchitoches Age: 54 Posts: 1,090 Rep Power: 0	Well you guys are basically ignoring history when you make these suggestions. If you recall, once upon a time it was fairly common for men to openly carry firearms.....why do you think every civilized nation in the world now has laws against this type of behavior? Here's a hint, it's not because the crime rate went down.....

05-03-2007, 04:52 PM	#8
joepole SBLive! Veteran Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 1,606 Rep Power: 272	>why do you think every civilized nation in the world now has laws against this type of behavior Correct or not, that's not a legit line of reasoning, "Everybody else is doing it" means nothing. Almost every civilized nation in the world has socialized medicine, as well.

05-03-2007, 04:56 PM	#9
joepole SBLive! Veteran Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 1,606 Rep Power: 272	>How can you say fewer lives would have been lost when only 1 man had a gun as opposed to 100 people having a gun, when our own nations history tells the exact opposite story? Because it's a reasonable assumption that none of the other likely-to-be-armed students wanted to go on a murderous rampage and it's a logical conclusion that if any other student had killed Cho before he could finish fewer lives would have been lost.

05-03-2007, 06:59 PM	#13
BrainSmashR Banned Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Natchitoches Age: 54 Posts: 1,090 Rep Power: 0	Hey that's great....how about stats for this country? BTW, I did NOT say fewer guns equals fewer deaths, I said MORE guns DOES NOT equal fewer deaths. Now check out this "hypothetical" scenario. Everytime someone gets pissed off they reach for their guns....you know, like every western story you've ever heard.

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